Apologetics for the Masses #378 - Hunter Street Baptist Church (Part 4 - Mary)

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Topic

Minister Brady Tarr's Anti-Catholic Presentation - Mary (cont'd)

 

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General Comments

Hey folks,

     Many thanks to those who volunteered to call/email questions for my upcoming TV series - Balaam's Ride.  I will get back with each of you in the next week or two with more details.  The series will begin on Monday, October 12th and each show will air several times a week.  Again, you can try downloading the app for the TV station - HTV10 - to your smart TV and/or to your smart phone.  Some folks have said they had a problem downloading the app to their particular brand of TV, and I am going to be looking into that, so please be patient on that front. 

     Also, I hope all of you will be willing to post details of the program on your Facebook pages, Twitter, Instagram, etc.  That would be a tremendous help!

 

Introduction

      This week is the fourth installation in my analysis/response to a very anti-Catholic presentation made at the Hunter Street Baptist Church here in Birmingham by one of their ministers - Brady Tarr.  We've covered the questions of authority and the Eucharist in the last two issues, this week we will continue our focus on Mary.  In this issue you'll see how Minister Tarr's arguments against Mary actually backfire on him as they result in him conferring divine status on Satan.

 

Challenge/Response/Strategy

Minister Brady Tarr of Hunter Street Baptist Church

     [In his presentation, under the heading of - "Catholic Catechism: Doctrine of Mary," Minister Tarr quotes from paragraphs #964, #966 - #969 of the Catechism. And then he presents the following...]

     Biblical Response: The Biblical Case Against Mary as Co-Redemptrix.

     Galatians 3:13, 1 Peter 3:18, and Hebrews 13:12.  Forgiveness of sins requires the shedding of blood.  The shedding of blood was required for the redemption (Heb 9:22).  1 Peter 1:18-19 affirms that only Jesus' blood could redeem man, not Mary's sufferings. 

    

My Comments

     Okay, first thing you will notice, if you read the paragraphs of the Catechism that are cited by Minister Tarr, is that not a one of them mentions the term, "Co-Redemptrix".  In fact, I don't believe the term "Co-Redemptrix" is mentioned anywhere in the Catechism.  At least, I haven't been able to find it in there.  Yet, here he is presenting arguments against Mary as "Co-Redemptrix" as if it is official Catholic teaching.  Where did he get "Co-Redemptrix" from?  He used a bait and switch.  First he quotes several passages from the Catechism, and then he quoted a "Catholic scholar" which makes it seem as if the Catechism passages he quoted used the term. 

     So, here we have one of the big problems with his overall presentation on Catholicism - he views Catholic "scholars" as being members of the Magisterium.  In other words, if a Catholic scholar says it, then that is official Church teaching.  This points to his deficiency of understanding regarding Catholic teaching and the Magisterium.  In Protestantism, "scholars" do indeed set doctrine and dogma, seeing as how they have no Magisterium to turn to.  But, non-scholars also set doctrine and dogma within Protestantism as Protestant theology generally gives every person the right to read Scripture on their own and interpret it as they see fit.  Why do you think we have tens of thousands upon tens of thousands of Protestant denominations?

     So, for Minister Tarr, what is said by pretty much any Catholic, and particularly the Catholic "scholars," is essentially Catholic doctrine or dogma. He apparently doesn't deem it necessary to investigate what the Church says in this particular instance.  Again, in this instance, he is arguing against Mary being called "Co-Redemptrix" when none of the paragraphs he cited in the Catechism use that term.  Also, it is clear that he did absolutely no research on what Catholics who do use that terminology mean by the term "Co-Redemptrix".  He thinks it means we are saying that Mary directly redeemed mankind in a manner equal or similar to what Jesus did.  That's why he is talking about her not shedding blood.  Sorry, Brady, but that's not at all what we mean by that term. 

     What a Catholic means when they call Mary, Co-Redemptrix, is that Mary participated in the redemption of mankind in a singularly unique way.  I mean, how many women gave birth to the Redeemer?  1.  Just one.  So we can say, as sin entered the world through Eve, so salvation entered the world through Mary.  Of no other woman can that be said.  The prefix "co" means "with".  Mary worked "with" Jesus in the redemption of mankind, as a subordinate.  She did that by saying, "Yes," to God at the Annunciation.  She did that by raising Him.  She did that by assisting in His ministry.  She did that by suffering with Him at the foot of the Cross.  She was not, however, equal to him in any way, shape, or form nor was anything she did or suffered equal to what He did by bleeding, suffering, and dying for us on the Cross. Church teaching states this explicitly: "...the Blessed Virgin's salutary influence on men...flows forth from the superabundance of the merits of Christ, rests on His mediation, depends entirely on it, and draws all its power from it. No creature could ever be counted along with the Incarnate Word and Redeemer..." (CCC #970).

     What she did in co-operating with Christ in the redemption of mankind was far and above what any other human being ever did or ever will do; however, it was not on the same level as what Christ Himself did for our redemption.  To say, or even imply, we believe such a thing, is ignorant, at best, malicious, at worst. 

    

Minister Brady Tarr

Biblical Response: Biblical Case Against Mary as Mediatrix of all graces

Rev 1:4; 2 John 1:3.  In order for Mary to be able to apply grace to billions of people around the world simultaneously without interruption until the end of the world, as Vatican II claimed, she would need to be able to be in different places at the same time.  Only one who is omnipresent could do such a thing.  Omnipresence, however, is a divine attribute of God.  One would need to be able to know who to give grace to, which would require one to be all-knowing.  Yet omniscience is also a divine attribute of God.  One would need to be powerful enough to apply grace to billions of people on the earth at the same time. Yet omnipotence is a divine attribute of God.  Rome, by claiming Mary is the mediatrix of all graces, ends up giving her divine attributes which only God has..."

 

My Comments

     Minister Tarr stated the following: "In order for Mary to be able to apply grace to billions of people around the world simultaneously without interruption until the end of the world, as Vatican II claimed..."  Here is what the passage from Vatican II he cited actually said: "Taken up to heaven she did not lay aside the saving office but by her manifold intercession continues to bring us the gifts of eternal salvation...Therefore the Blessed Virgin is invoked in the Church under the titles of Advocate, Helper, Benefactress, and Mediatrix. This, however, is so understood that it neither takes away anything from nor adds anything to the dignity and efficacy of Christ the one Mediator," (Lumen Gentium, #62).

     So, Vatican II doesn't say anything about Mary "apply[ing]" grace to billions of people.  It says via her "intercession" she brings us the gifts of eternal salvation.  That's observation #1.  The 2nd observation I have regarding his statement is this: Where does it say that Mary interceding for billions of people, or even applying grace to billions of people, means that she has to be "in different places at the same time"?  She couldn't do that from Heaven?  But, let's say, for the sake of argument, it does require Mary being in different places at the same time...could God not grant her the power to do so?  Does Minister Tarr believe that it is not possible for God to do that?  Apparently so.  Third, "omnipresent" means everywhere, as in the entire universe and outside of the universe.  While being in different places at the same time here on earth is an awesome and amazing thing, it is not necessarily the same as being "omnipresent," as God is present everywhere not just here on earth, but even unto the farthest reaches of the universe, where there is no one for Mary to "apply" grace to. 

     The funny thing is, though, that Minister Tarr believes Satan tempts billions of people all over the world at the same time.  I assume, then, he believes that Satan would have to be "in different places at the same time".  Which means, by Minister Tarr's logic and assumptions, that "only one who is omnipresent could do such a thing."  I.e., Minister Tarr, and Hunter Street Baptist Church, are giving Satan divine attributes. 

     Also, for Satan to tempt so many people around the world at the same time until the end of time, he would have to know something about what they are doing, what their weaknesses are, how to exploit those weaknesses, and so forth.  Which would require, by Minister Tarr's logic, Satan to be all-knowing.  "Yet omniscience is also a divine attribute of God."  And, Satan would have to be powerful enough to be able to tempt billions of people at the same time.  "Yet omnipotence is a divine attribute of God."

     All in all, using Minister Tarr's faulty reasoning and his faulty assumptions, by which he concludes "Rome" gives Mary divine attributes, one must conclude that Hunter Street Baptist Church gives Satan divine attributes.   

 

Closing Comments

     That's it for this week...a relatively short newsletter.  Next issue might have one last go at Minister Tarr's anti-Catholic presentation - the part of it relating to how Catholics get salvation wrong - or I might just move on.  Haven't quite decided yet. 

     Either way, I hope you have a great week!

 

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Apologetics for the Masses